dean wrote:
Dean,
I've been lurking on the list for quite some time. I enjoy a lot of the
posts but I had to write in because this claim to an ion engine made by some
Indian 100 years ago is ridiculous. Did Vimanas exist thousands of years
ago? yes, probably. But they were the result of a super technological
civilization, which was not the case 100 years ago in India.
Even putting the lack of evidence aside, the claim is ridiculous because
there was not enough of an infrastructure in India 100 years ago to even
lend itself to the creation of such a craft. There was, however a
technoligical infrastructure in the USA 100 years ago, at least enough to
build an airplane. So the Wrights claim remains intact with ample
evidence. It is one thing to search the ancient writings and see the
possibility of advanced science in days of old, it is another to adopt a
blindly "vedo-centric" outlook on everything and throwing out common sense
in the process. It kind of reminds me of Afrocentrism and how afrocentrics
lay claim to the discovery of electricity simply because someone in africa
was aware of electric eels!
Sean
Dharma/Dean wrote:
THE VEDIC ION ENGINE
By Bhalchandra Patwardhan
The National Aeronautics and Space Administration was planning a
rendezvous
with Haley's comet in the 1980s. They planned to use a space probe powered
by an Ion Engine. This Engine used a stream of high-velocity electrified
particles instead of a blast of hot gases. The theory of the Ion Engine
has
been credited to Robert Goddard, long recognized as the father of
Liquid-fuel Rocketry. It is claimed that in 1906, long before Goddard
launched his first modern rocket, his imagination had conceived the idea
of
an Ion rocket; however, in light of new evidence, the story could be
entirely different.
In 1895 on a beach in the city of Mumbai (Bombay, Maharashtra, India),
Shivkar Bapuji Talpade, a Sanskrit scholar, proved that heavier-than-air
flight was indeed possible. This demonstration was attended by eminent
citizens including, among others, His Highness Maharaja Sayajirao Gaekwand
of Baroda and Mr. Justice Ranade, and was reported in "The Kesari" a
leading
Marathi daily newspaper. Readers might note that this occurred a full
eight
years before the Wright Brothers' "First" flight at Kitty hawk, North
Carolina, USA. An even more astonishing feature of Talpade's craft was the
power source he used- An Ion Engine."
Certain verses in the 10th chapter of the Rig-Veda make reference to the
Art
of Flight. The great Rishi Bharadvaja has written a commentary on this in
his book "Yantra Vidya" (Science of Machines). Bharadvaja elucidates the
mechanism that provides the impulse needed for propulsion. It involves the
combination of eight sub-assemblies and uses the interaction of
principally
Solar energy and Mercury. Talpade put his knowledge of Sanskrit at the
disposal of his creative intellect and CONSTRUCTED AN AIRCRAFT ACCORDING
TO
THE DESCRIPTION GIVEN IN THE RIG-VEDA. IT IS REPORTED THAT THIS FLYING
MACHINE GAINED AN ALTITUDE OF 1500 FT. MOST APTLY, HE CALLED HIS AIRCRAFT
THE "MARUTSAKHA"- FRIEND OF THE WIND.
The engine now being developed for future use by NASA, by some strange
coincidence, also uses Mercury bombardment units powered by Solar cells.
Interestingly, the impulse is generated in seven stages. The Mercury
propellant is first vaporized, fed into the thruster discharge chamber,
ionized, converted into plasma by a combination with electrons, broken
down
electrically, and then accelerated through small openings in a screen to
pass out of the engine at velocities between 20,000 and 50,000 meters per
second.
Although minute details of the Vedic engine would be available only after
great research, the resemblance of the "modern" engine to it is totally
indisputable. The Ion Engine developed by NASA is capable of producing, at
best, about one pound of thrust- a thrust which is virtually useless for
lifting an object of any practical mass off the earth. Talpade's engine,
on
the other hand, was entirely capable of lifting his aircraft 1500 feet
into
the air, over 100 years ago.
Several important considerations emerge from the foregoing discussion.
First, Wilbur and Orville Wright were not the pioneers of modern flight.
Secondly, not only had the idea of an Ion Engine been conceived long
before
Dr Goddard, but it had also been materialized in the form of Talpade's
Marutsakha Aircraft. I do not wish to denigrate those inventors, whose
contributions are invaluable, but I think it is now time to review the
history of science and recognize the achievements of the previous
civilizations. The question of the exaltation or diminution of any country
or civilization's contribution does not arise. My only contention is that
if
scientific thought began in Vedic civilization earlier than in the West,
we
should not ignore that fact in our narration of the history of science.
(Reproduced from ANCIENT SKIES, BI-monthly published by the ANCIENT
ASTRONAUT SOCIETY, 192 St. Johns Ave. Highland Park, Illinois 60035 USA.From a compilation by Mr. Oak.)
Sean,
If this has been documented, as stated, how can you object? Using the
electric eel to electricity comparison, is like comparing a fire-fly to an
airplane, which is not the case here. Sorry, I stand behind Dean on this one.
MM
Here is a book on the subject which a guy on another list mentioned.
Dean
Please refer to William Clendenon's translation of the
"Samarangana Sutradhara "from his 1990 book " Mercury,
UFO Messenger of the Gods"..Basically, there are three
types of flying machines identified in scriptures. they are
mantrika, tantrika and kritakaah. The propulsion and power
systems sets them apart. In Kali yuga, it is supposed to be the
third one (mechanical engines) which will take to skies. If I am
not mistaken, what Talpade demonstrated was a mercury vortex engine.
The Vymaanika Shastra by Maharshi Bharadwaja, refers to
close to 100 past authorities on these flying machines.
Needless to say, they are all extinct. Scholars have
dated this text from at least the fourth century B.C
Sean,
To tell the truth, the claim is a hard one to research. Some advanced
technologies are hinted at in the Vedic literature. Alchemy is mentioned,
and there are statements saying that mercury and bell metal are invloved in
the process. I believe that they used mantras, i.e., certain frequencies of
sound, to bring the chemical reactions about.
But I have to be honest, I don't what what techniques that Hindu fellow
could have used 100 years ago, nor can I research it.
Sometimes I bring things up as food for thought, I am not adamant about
everything I run by the list.
Dharma/Dean
MM,
I can easily object to the so called "documented" claim of an ion
engine carrying a craft skyward 100 years ago by some Indian. If anyone, it
would have probably been an Englishman who even came close to succeeding at
producing any such device since Britain brought science and technology to
India in the modern era, but even that would be absurd considering the
technology of the day. If it was said to be a documented "sighting" of
some sort of craft, i.e. a UFO, then that's another story entirely.
Sean