I missed mentioning , in case you hadn't already correlated this about Parshuram , that his name Parshu Ram meant Ram , "the wielder of the battle-axe" , his weapon of choice !
Regards
On Thursday, September 20, 2018, 2:38:12
AM GMT+5:30, Soretna [email protected]
Sidhartha,
I thought he carried a hammer and scythe, like on the communist flags.
Dean
Dean , here is a compact concise article about the short tempered Parshuram and his famous axe...the saying "an axe to grind" might well have originated from Parshuram's usage of it - he had one hell of an axe to grind against the warrior tribes of that time (in the Northwestern part of Indian subcontinent) !
Also , notice reference in Parshuram's story to the sacred cow . It's name was "Kamadhenu" and legend has it that Kamadhenu was the first cow on Earth - which is why cow has been worshipped only in India since pre-historic times & it's only in India that beef is not eaten .Domestication of cattle coincided with the start of agriculture , which began in the ancient Indian civilisation of the Indus Valley (in present day Pakistan) around 9,000 B.C. :
The Axe of Parshuram
In Vedic times Rishis used to perform yagnas to harness the power of the cosmos for the benefit of the king or Raja and his kingdom. The Raja in turn ensured the livelihood of the priests by gifting them cows. The Puranas, however, refer to a period, when this symbiotic relationship soured, transforming both the kings and their priests forever.
This shift happens before the arrival of Ram and is marked by another of Vishnu’s avatar, Parashuram, which literally translates as ‘the axe-bearing Ram’. He is also called Bhargava Ram or ‘Ram of the priestly Bhrigu clan’, distinguishing him from Raghava Ram or ‘Ram of the royal Raghu clan’.
Parshuram’s grandmother, Satyavati, was a princess, daughter of Gadhi. She was given in marriage to Richika, Parashuram’s grandfather. It was common practice for Rajas to offer their daughters to Rishis, along with cows.
Parshuram’s father, the Rishi Jamadagni, had received a cow from a king of the Haihaiya clan. The king’s son Kritarjuna or Kartaviryarjuna demanded the cow back.
When Jamadagni refused, the king took the cow by force, angering Parshuram, who refused to take things lying down. He raised an axe and hacked the king to death. The king’s sons retaliated by beheading Jamadagni. An infuriated Parshuram went on to slaughter five clans of warriors, some say five generations of warriors, creating five lakes of blood. These lakes were later filled and became the dreaded battlefield of Kurukshetra.
It is said that Parashuram continued killing every Kshatriya in his path until there were no more warriors left on earth. To restore the Kshatriya clans the widows had to marry priests. There is one story of a man called Nari-kavacha, meaning ‘one whose armor was made of women’. He survived by hiding in women’s quarters. All women went to this one surviving warrior and from this coward were born all future warriors. Perhaps stories such as these were propaganda crated by Rishis to insult kings who did not behave as Rajas are supposed to, as custodians rather than masters of their kingdoms.
Rishis were known to oppose kings who did not do their duty. There are tales of how Rishis ousted Pururava who went mad after his wife, the nymph Urvashi, left him. There are stories of how Rishis killed Vena who abused his power and exploited the earth. Parshuram’s massacre of kings only stopped when he met Ram, the son of Dashrath, who was so perfect a Raja that he restored Parashuram’s faith in kings and ended his slaughter.
Parshuram threw his bloodstained axe into the sea but the sea recoiled in horror and drew back revealing a new coast now known as the Konkan and the Malabar, which is why Paashuram worship is most prevalent in the western coast of India. Many Rishis and Brahmins shunned Parshuram as they felt he was contaminated with blood and murder. Determined to pass on his knowledge of warfare to priests who could balance the power of kings, Parshuram is supposed to have gone to a crematorium and resurrected dead priests, who became his students. One theory states that the Chitpavan Brahmans of Pune who dominated Indian political scene in the 18thcentury sprang from these resurrected priests hence the name Chitpavan meaning ‘purified from the funeral pyre’. Parshuram even passed on his martial skills today known as Kalaripayattu to families who were of mixed blood, whose mothers were from warrior clans but fathers were of priestly clans, like, some say, the Nair community in Kerala.
It is interesting to note that Parshuram’s granduncle was one of those who abused his royal power against the Rishis. His name was Kaushik and he was Satyavati’s brother. Kaushik tried to steal the cow that belonged to Rishi Vasishtha. Unlike Jamadagni, Vasishtha was able to defend himself using his spiritual powers. Humiliated in defeat, Kaushik decided to acquire spiritual powers for himself. Just as Parshuram had abandoned his priestly ways to become a warrior, Kaushik gave his warrior ways to become the Rishi Vishwamitra. Just as Parashuram became a warrior to create a better world, free of corrupt kings, Vishwamitra became a teacher and a priest to create a better world, where spiritual powers were used to bring material growth. Vishwamitra was a teacher of Ram.
Regards
deandddd wrote:
Sidhartha,
I thought he carried a hammer and scythe, like on the communist flags.
Dean #yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569 -- #yiv2307863569ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-mkp #yiv2307863569hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-mkp #yiv2307863569ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-mkp .yiv2307863569ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-mkp .yiv2307863569ad p {margin:0;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-mkp .yiv2307863569ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-sponsor #yiv2307863569ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-sponsor #yiv2307863569ygrp-lc #yiv2307863569hd {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}#yiv2307863569 #yiv2307863569ygrp-sponsor #yiv2307863569ygrp-lc .yiv2307863569ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 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Sidhartha,
These look nice, and I'll read them.
But I really think that Parashara appeared in the hollow earth, not Goa.
The Hindus have this insistence of India being the cradle of Vedic civilization, but Bal Gangadhar Tilk was the man for me!
Dean
Well Dean, Tilak would probably be a superior reference in comparison to
most others given his background, especially during the timeframe in which
he lived. It doesn't seem like many others truly followed in his footsteps
after him in this regard though (except perhaps in social reforms), which
is both disappointing and sad.
It seems as though it is difficult to really track down some of these truly
profound Indians as many of them are squelched. This gentleman seems to be
one and Jagadish Chandra Bose was another one who really broke some
seriously important scientfic ground, but has been essentially altogether
forgotten in terms of his plant research. It would be nice to find other
comparable illuminaries.
Soretna, Dean , I agree that Tilak probably came the closest to figuring out the Vedas...There is unmistakable evidence in some of the Rig Vedic hymns that the observer or composer of the hymn was located near the North Pole...example - Sun rises from the South !
From there we can extrapolate that the Vedic people may originally have emerged from the Hollow Earth via the North Polar opening .
Coming to Parshuram , he lived in the Tretayug , by which time the Vedic culture was well established in the Indian subcontinent . It was also in the Tretayug that the Rig Veda (oldest among the 4 Vedas) was collated .
Now here comes the twist in the tale - the Rig Veda itself states that the stories being narrated in it come from a much , much earlier time !
Rig Veda contains several stories from the Satyuga , of the conflict between the Devas (demi gods) & Asuras . The geography is vague in satyuga - rivers and mountains of the Indian subcontinent are not highlighted , the way they are clearly marked out in stories of Tretayug - such as that of Parshuram .
So my gut feel is- during the Sat Yug, Vedic people may have emerged out of Hollow Earth , then made their way towards India ,where that cultural continuity was maintained to a fair degree (though not entirely) . In the Tretayug , Dwapar Yug and the on going Kalyug , the Puranic stories clearly state geographic landmarks of Indian subcontinent .
There is one other intriguing possibility - Vedic people from hollow earth may also have been able to reach Indian subcontinent (over the ages) via some of the numerous cavern openings in the Himalaya mountains or in Central Asia .
Regards
On Sat, Sep
22, 2018 at 11:20 AM [email protected]
Sidhartha,
I would also be interested in seeing some of the comments from the Tamil literature defining geography. I have read, for example, in Churchward's boosk, that there are descriptions of Kanya Kumari, now under water.
I haven't meant to say that the fact that the Puranas make comments about the hollow earth are dependent on the Parashuram story and how a certain word in translated.
The whole storyline about the Sons of Sagara involved going in and out of the hollow portion three times, total.
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And how a word is used, the context, determines much of its meaning. I know a famous translator in Brazil, an Englishman, and he says that if you believe in the dictionary, you might as well believe in the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus.
Anyway, here is another one that I have just now come across in my perusal of Vedic material. It is from Canto Nine, Chapter Eleven, Verse Fifteen of the Bhagavat Purana. It refers to how Sitadevi, the wife of the Ram Avatar, disappeared from the face of the Earth at the end of the Ram Pastimes, and to where she went!
http://bhagavata.org/canto9/chapter11.html http://bhagavata.org/canto9/chapter11.html
Go down and read the sentence after Number 15 in blue. "Into the Earth" is in the Sanskrit as the word "vivaram" or "within the earth", according to the word for word translation by A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami, Prabhupad. According to the online spokensanskrit.org, "vivaram" means , variably, "opening, dilation, split, hole, chasm, expansion, widening, breech, hollow". The word "pravivesha" is also in the verse, right after the word vivaram, meaning "went into".
By the way, if this "am" ending of "vivaram" can mean "went into", in the ablative case as in the English preposition "to", then the "Pritivim" word used in relation to Parashuram and his banishing of the warrior caste can mean that the warriors were banished "to" the surface.
Good night.
Dean
Dean , true - Sitadevi , wife of Ram (7th Avatar of Lord Vishnu) does go into the Earth , as per what is described in the Ramayana epic. Parshuram also makes an appearance in the Ramayan epic , when he once angrily confronted Ram , only to realise & accept Ram's divinity .
Sons of Sagar is another clear story of hollow earth where the great Rishi Kapila was meditating in hollow earth , when these men barged onto the scene , thus inviting the sage's wrath for having rudely disrupted his deep meditation , who then reduced them to ashes merely by the spiritual power inherent in his searing gaze (using the power of his awakened third eye/pineal gland) .
In the Rig Veda , there are some really strange hymns about the movement of our Sun , which make no sense for an observer in the Indian subcontinent :
The geography described in the Rig Veda has 9 continents and it seems the continents of inner earth have also been counted...it says that these 9 continents have been arranged like the petals of a lotus flower . This is a telling comment , because in a lotus flower , petals are arranged in concentric circular pattern , the way it would be if one were to take a composite geographical view of continents on outer surface as well as inner surface . Most scholars of the 19th and 20th century had rubbished the geography described in Rig Veda , as "making no sense" at all , probably because they had no concept of hollow earth and that there may exist continents and oceans on the inner surface as well...
**The composite human society described in the Vedas seems to be spread across the outer and inner surfaces of the Earth . The "link" between the two surfaces , seems to have been lost by the time of Dwapar Yug (third of the 4 Yugas) .
So to conclude , yes , the Vedic stories of the Devas (demi-gods) in Satyug , with it's vague geography , might well be from Hollow Earth , whereas the events of the later 3 yugas (Tretayug , Dwapar and the current Kalyug that began 5,000 years ago) occurred in the Indian subcontinent , given the clear geographical references to Indian subcontinent in the stories of Parshuram , Ram and Krishna Avatars .
Regards
deandddd wrote:
Sidhartha,
I would also be interested in seeing some of the comments from the Tamil literature defining geography. I have read, for example, in Churchward's boosk, that there are descriptions of Kanya Kumari, now under water.
I haven't meant to say that the fact that the Puranas make comments about the hollow earth are dependent on the Parashuram story and how a certain word in translated.
The whole storyline about the Sons of Sagara involved going in and out of the hollow portion three times, total.
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And how a word is used, the context, determines much of its meaning. I know a famous translator in Brazil, an Englishman, and he says that if you believe in the dictionary, you might as well believe in the Easter Bunny and Santa Claus.
Anyway, here is another one that I have just now come across in my perusal of Vedic material. It is from Canto Nine, Chapter Eleven, Verse Fifteen of the Bhagavat Purana. It refers to how Sitadevi, the wife of the Ram Avatar, disappeared from the face of the Earth at the end of the Ram Pastimes, and to where she went!
Go down and read the sentence after Number 15 in blue. "Into the Earth" is in the Sanskrit as the word "vivaram" or "within the earth", according to the word for word translation by A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami, Prabhupad. According to the online spokensanskrit.org, "vivaram" means , variably, "opening, dilation, split, hole, chasm, expansion, widening, breech, hollow". The word "pravivesha" is also in the verse, right after the word vivaram, meaning "went into".
By the way, if this "am" ending of "vivaram" can mean "went into", in the ablative case as in the English preposition "to", then the "Pritivim" word used in relation to Parashuram and his banishing of the warrior caste can mean that the warriors were banished "to" the surface.
Good night.
Dean #yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399 -- #yiv1983885399ygrp-mkp {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;font-family:Arial;margin:10px 0;padding:0 10px;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-mkp hr {border:1px solid #d8d8d8;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-mkp #yiv1983885399hd {color:#628c2a;font-size:85%;font-weight:700;line-height:122%;margin:10px 0;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-mkp #yiv1983885399ads {margin-bottom:10px;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-mkp .yiv1983885399ad {padding:0 0;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-mkp .yiv1983885399ad p {margin:0;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-mkp .yiv1983885399ad a {color:#0000ff;text-decoration:none;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-sponsor #yiv1983885399ygrp-lc {font-family:Arial;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-sponsor #yiv1983885399ygrp-lc #yiv1983885399hd {margin:10px 0px;font-weight:700;font-size:78%;line-height:122%;}#yiv1983885399 #yiv1983885399ygrp-sponsor #yiv1983885399ygrp-lc .yiv1983885399ad {margin-bottom:10px;padding:0 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Tilak's explanation didn't really gather steam because the chauvanist Hindus don't want to accept any kind of Aryan Invasion or migration.
But they have European blood, and it came from Europe; it didn't come from China or the planet Mars.
So they are not comfortable with Tilak, no.
Chers!
Sidhartha,
You mentioned:
*The composite human society described in the Vedas seems to be spread across the outer and inner surfaces of the Earth . The "link" between the two surfaces , seems to have been lost by the time of Dwapar Yug (third of the 4 Yugas) .
I think that something slipped your mind ...
Jarasandha!!!
The The Hollow Earth and the Aryan Invasion Theory Revised
http://www.holloworbs.com/aryan_invasion.htm
The red dot on the map is erroneous, I am going to change it tomorrow.
Cheers!
I have just changed the map!
DDD
Ah, I see, you're using the new Navy data from Rodney Cluff's news + other discussions we've had. Here's the map comparison of the previous one (left) you had vs new one (right) with the old map rotated and side-by-side in order to show the shift:
Soretna,
Satellite photos have definitely shown that the opening is on the Russian side.
It can be found in the top two images thusly: To the right of the word "ICE" is The New Siberian Island Group, and the opening is above those islands in the ice. The opening is always at that point, always round and often filled with mist.
http://www.holloworbs.com/Location_Orifice.htm
Cheers!
Folks , before we even aspire to shatter common "misconceptions" on such sensitive topics of ethnic/cultural origin , we need to first admit to the formidable challenge it poses , especially because we live in this spiritually dark Kalyug era...
In the spirit of straight talk , I am going to be blunt and what follows may not be very pleasant to read , so here is a STATUTARY WARNING , please do proceed further , only IF you can with a TRULY open mind :-
Majority of people in the world do NOT even begin to realise how deep rooted their ethnic/religious/linguistic/regional/cultural BIASES really are !
Such ethnic/cultural biases of people never fail to bring out the WORST in them .
Very , very few people can actually , really , handle the RAW , UNADULTERATED TRUTH . Most people are so conditioned to believe CRAP and their heads are so full of BULLSHIT , right from childhood , that they cannot even distinguish falsehood from truth , even when the answer is starting them directly in the face .
Many people just pretend to be impartial , but are in reality thoroughly unethical and downright DISHONEST when it comes to such "sensitive" matters - especially those who are strongly motivated by ideology , whether of the Right or the Left :))
**5. There exist unbelievable levels of sheer HYPOCRISY and double talk in the hallowed circles of the Academic world , when it comes to such sensitive subjects :)) It's just DISGUSTING !
Now coming back to the topic in question , well , Vedic influence on the Indian subcontinent goes back a very , very , very long time , simply because of the numerous cavern world openings leading from Hollow Earth (Shambhalla/Agartha) to the outer surface , scattered across the vast Himalayan region...!
So yes , while there was a large scale migration , NOT invasion of Vedic people , from the Arctic into South Asia during the ice age , Vedic imprint on the Indian subcontinent predates even that prehistoric migration event - which itself likely occurred tens of thousands of years ago...so for all practical purposes , it's been like FOREVER , especially if you accept the theory of cyclical repopulation of Earth's outer surface - from Hollow Earth , at the start of every new Chaturyug :))
Regards
