Will, If the cute Amazonian Princesses are also twelve foot tall, it could
be a problem? Hazel
Dean, I know you addressed this query to Leslee, but I too am learning to
love Etidorhpa; the lyrical 19thCentury language is a delight to read, and
if I had a printer it would be my bedtime book, but it's long and difficult
to read onscreen. The fact that the title has a 'hidden meaning' suggests
the entire book has too. For a work of 'fiction' it is embellished with
precise physics and science, at least a century ahead of it's time, hardly
necessary to elucidate a 'fantasy.' Still reading...Haze
Will wrote;>
hollow earth inhabitants are trying to increase awareness on upper-earth of
their existence. Like you, I think they will surface after or during World
War III to annihilate the armies of the Antichrist, the UN!! End of Days?
Bring it on...
Hazel
Hi Guys:
This is a bit "out there" but I am going to speculate anyway. I would not think that the light changes much in a HE.
-
Leslee,
-
It is important to brainstorm, go ahead and speculate. I will " argue " Cater's theory.
For one thing--in Etidorhpa--the guide states that the light comes from all around, including the ground--so, where in the ground does it come from? What is it's source?
- It comes from the soft particles which pass through the ground.
Perhaps the light source of the HE is not dependent on the rotation of the Earth--since it is not the same "sunlight" as we have here.
- Well, I think that Will was thinking that, if the light is a matter of the soft particlespassing through the shell, then the part of the shell which is on the dark side, away from the sun, might experience dimming. I don't know, and Cater wasn't too hot on that at all. There could still be enough soft particles seeping through to last until the shell comes around again.
Also, the guide states that we do not yet know what this light source is. So, could artificial lighting also penetrate the earth---in addition to sunlight, and perhaps even other celestial bodies. When it is dark above the earth--we humans turn on the lights--but that light also has to go somewhere, doesn't it? Or am I way off? When the sun sets on Earth, I would guess it is still working it's way through the crust. Let's say the sun sets above the earth at 9 PM---well, that last bit of sun would just be hitting the Earth's surface. How many hours do you think it takes for the process of the light from above to work through the crust?
-
Ok, so you are saying that maybe there is some artificial lighting in addition to the soft particles which break up into visible photons as they pass their way through? Maybe some luminous crystals? I think that the soft particles take a while, the word which the Guide used to refer to their passage was " seep." He didn't say that they " whiz by." So if they take some time, some days, to pass through, then no areas have to be left in the dark, so to speak. You'll notice that the auroras take a day or two to occurr after sunspot activity. This time lapse suggests that the passage ins't a matter of minutes nor off seconds. Anyway, the buildup in the hollow cavity takes some time.
-
I think that dark areas stay dark under there in the caverns immediately below the surface. The soft particles haven't had time to break up yet. But I say " dark " for us. I suspect that animals perceive with soft particles as we do with visible light.
If long enough, then couldn't this be a continual process w/o interruption?
- So yes, I do think that it is, and that light never goes dark- not in cavern worlds, and not in the hollow portion. By the time the soft particles reaches the hollow cavity, it is groggy enough to break up upon contact with any other particle it runs into. Therefore, the generation of light within the cavity must be constant and omnipresent, no matter which side is facing where.
Another idea could be that HE'ers senses are perhaps better--and that they are able to see/sense "refined" light where we wouldn't. I mean--light just doesn't disappear does it? Doesn't it continue, but our human eyes are unable to see it past a certain diffusion point? An idea, Leslee
- I don't know about the hollow Earthers in the cavity, but the Guide certainly had perception of soft particles and couldsee immediately below the surface, when The Man was experiencing total darkness. I bet that cats can perceive like the man.
Got to run.
DD
Hazel,
I have Etidorhpa up on a different site, I don't know if you are aware.
It has been divided into Etidorhpa 1, 2 and 3 for quicker download.
You can get the book through www.bibliofind.com for as little as three
dollars plus shipping.
Dharma/Dean
Good morning people,
From what I've read, the light sounds more like an astral light.
I've read accounts where people who have been trapped in underground
caves for a period of time, suddenly reported the underground area to be
suffused with a soft glow that enabled them to see.
Perhaps this is the same?
Love, Rose
Dear Hazel,
When various writers of fiction have written about Atlantis and
Lemuria (again, Lin Carter comes to mind with his THONGOR
OF LEMURIA series), they have built elaborate fantasies around
previously-existing mythical concepts. I would like to say that this
is what Lin Carter did with Zanothodon but NO, he INVENTED IT
OUT OF HIS OWN IMAGINATION. I challenge you to find
independent documentation of a non-fictional Zanthodon; I have
"the dictionary of imaginary places" as well, and it quite clearly
adopts the "creative rationale" of each fictional writer in its
commentary on each entry, pretending that they are authoritative
and true. It further confuses the issue by mixing GENUINE
MYTHOLOGY with FICTION. In other words, it quotes the fiction
of Lin Carter as if it were TRUTH. It does the same for the "facts"
of OZ, Lilliput, and a variety of other locations. Do you also
believe that these are somehow real?
Zanthodon DOES NOT EXIST IN ANY ANCIENT TRADITION.
This was a literary device which Carter used when he made up
the name. It is a purely made-up name of very Carter-esque
style, quite similar to many, many others he "made up." And the
Eric Carstairs novels are, quite frankly, considered to be some of
the worst science fiction ever written.
You can say that "to the Sumerians, or the Chinese, or the
Welsh, it was so-and-so," but it sure as hell wasn't "Zanthodon,"
was it? Complete with dinosaurs and cavemen, and a direct
homage and imitation of Burrough's Pellucidar, I might add. Tell
you what, dig up "Zanthodon" in a non-fiction, non-dictionary of
imaginary places-context, and I might reconsider. But is
WHOLLY FICTIONAL.
Sorry if I sound harsh, but clouding the search for facts with
fiction, fantasy, and so on will never solve any mystery and only
makes credibility and fact-finding both more difficult to achieve or
demonstrate. It would be just as logical to believe in the reality of
Burrough's BARSOOM (Mars), or PELLUCIDAR (his hollow
earth). Or OZ, for that matter.
One can't just consider whatever fits one's personal
philosophical point of view in a theory, one must consider all the
evidence, even the unpleasant or discrediting. If a theory still
stands after this, then one might be on to something.
--Mike
Hi Rose,
This is a good point. Astral light is subtle and diffused, same when a celestial being is present and is seen. Maybe because when we see astral light we are actually vibrating in concert with those on another plane, which of course the HE is.
You mention when people are stuck in caves they see a diffused light. Same can be said for a dark room, strolling in the night. lost in the wilderness. I think we need to quit thinking the HE is filled with "sunlight", and start calling it "refined light".
I can see it as almost a thin fog; light, with a bit gray, somewhat like a photograph shot with a soft camera lens that captures the gentle mist at dawn hovering above the ocean shore. Easy on the eyes!
Love, Leslee
Good morning people,
From what I've read, the light sounds more like an astral light.
I've read accounts where people who have been trapped in underground
caves for a period of time, suddenly reported the underground area to be
suffused with a soft glow that enabled them to see.
Perhaps this is the same?
Love, Rose
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Mike, If what you have said is true, and it probably is, then surely the
same must be said of Etidorhpa and the suppossed reptile man, etc.? However,
these 'mythical' novels have an uncanny resemblance to 'know' facts, such
as, these realms are subterranean, habitats of prehistoric creatures, the
home of giants, and a very sacred land? Yours, Reproved, Hazel.
Hazel.
Dear Hazel,
I think that we are talking about degrees of quality and meaning.
"Zanthodon," for instance, was based wholly of Burrough's work,
and Lin Carter gladly acknowledged this as he was a huge fan of
Burroughs. But Burrough's Pellucidar, on the other hand, had
much more depth, took a hard look at the science behind the
hollow earth concept, etc. It was based on the work of Symmes,
primarily, but Burroughs had obviously done a great deal of
research on the topic. Like Verne, he populated the inner world
with prehistoric reptiles, including reptilian humanoids.
The trick here is to follow the tradition or thread. Verne, as some
have postulated, seems to have been a member of many secret
societies, and thus disguised many "truths" as fiction or else
strongly hinted at them in his books. So did H.G. Wells, and the
"visionary" power of both men may have been due to their
involvement with certain esoteric, secret-knowledge societies.
So Verne's inner world of reptiles (very likely a model or
inspiration for Burroughs), along with Well's allusion to an
unseen cavern world which manipulates surface humanity
(demonstrated in The Time Machine through his "fable" of the
Eloi and the dero-like Morlocks) might very well be attempts on
their part to "tell" us all something, without really coming out and
saying. For instance, The Time Machine predicted many events
of the 20th century with amazing accuracy, and Verne's work
predicted the Submarine, the Lunar Capsule, a form of nuclear
power, and so on. I think that, given the underhanded
shenanigans and cover-ups in the world today, we would all do
well to get a copy of The Time Machine and re-read the section
about the Morlocks. Wells was definitely trying to tell us
something!
The same thing can be said for Lloyd's Etidorpha. The
information presented parallels much "traditional" and "esoteric"
schools of thought, including but not limited to the cavern worlds,
the change in matter density at different levels, the inner
concavity ("hollow earth") and so on. The physics and the
philosophy presented both indicate an uncanny knowledge of
supposedly "secret" or "mystical" traditions. The very name
Etidorpha, which is Aphrodite spelled backwards, may be a hint
from the start that the book is an allegorical puzzle to be solved,
and may be based in fact.
Carter's work--all of his fiction--was pure escapist fantasy, and
there's nothing wrong with that. But he came nowhere near the
level of a Burroughs, Verne or Wells in terms of quality,
originality, or of "hinting" or telling secret or largely-unknown
things. He was purely an imitator, and that's pretty much the
reputation he has today in the scifi-fantasy world.
There are books like those of Verne, Wells, Lloyd, Emerson and
others which seem to be fiction overlaying truth (possibly for the
author's own protection, for instance in the interest of not
breaking a secret society oath or vow), or else they ARE truth,
disguised as fiction. Books like this aren't too numerous, but
they're out there. I believe Leslee mentioned Lewis Carroll, and
he, too, seems to have been hinting at some greater concealed
reality.....
The inside of the Earth may be a place with many cavities,
caverns, layers, levels, and an ultimate hollowness at the center.
If so, there might be room for both good and evil there, in
numerous forms, of numerous types....
--Mike
Mike, I see, the degrees of quality and meaning are relevant only if they
fit into current theories, but if they don't, then it is wholly fantasy. You
said, Zanthodon DOES NOT EXIST IN ANY ANCIENT TRADITION. Does Etidorhpa,
Verne's inner-world, Alice's wonderland or Fraggle Rock? And isn't this,
"clouding the search for facts with fiction, fantasy, and so on will never
solve any mystery and only makes credibility and fact-finding both more
difficult to achieve or demonstrate." (?)
Sorry to be so harsh, Hazel.
No problem.
Hazel, I said this as a response to your quoting from a fanciful
book of fictional definitions which quoted, in turn, from Lin
Carter's fiction! There is a considerable difference here.
Carter's work is FICTION, and additionally it contains no esoteric
or obscure knowledge. It is PURE ESCAPISM. Burrough's work
was escapist as well, but at least he BASED IT ON SYMMES
AND OTHERS, i.e. genuine hollow earth research from a
scientific point of view. To go further into the "allegorical" style of
Verne, Wells, Lloyd, and the rest, they were NOT writing pure
escapist material, as they ALLUDED TO ACTUAL MYSTERIES
AND ESOTERIC CONCEPTS as well as SCIENTIFIC
CONCEPTS WHICH WERE UNKNOWN IN THEIR DAY. In other
words, it is evident that they were attempting to convey certain
truths through thinly-veiled fictional accounts of genuine
concepts. They also make reference to genuine ancient
traditions along these lines, or allusions to them as in the case
of Verne and Wells.
Yes, ZANTHODON IS PURE FICTION. It had its genesis in the
brain of Lin Carter, as a IMITATION of Burrough's
more-factually-based fiction. It makes no serious or successful
pretensions otherwise, certainly not to be "True." It is NOT in the
Eluma Elish, nor anywhere else save in paperback fiction form.
So I will elaborate. Zanthodon is not only purely fictional, it has
NO value as a guide, hint, source of knowledge, research
source, or other usage in terms of hollow or inner earth
knowledge. It also owes its inspiration to the TARZAN novels of
Edgar Rice Burroughs, such "Tarzan and the Jewels of Opar,"
which features an ancient Atlantean city hidden inside of a
mountain region. Jim Henson's "Labyrinth" does contain the
type of relevant information, for instance. Marvel Comics'
KA-ZAR, living in a hidden tropical valley at the South Pole,
contains much more somewhat-meaningful information that
Carter's rip-off of Burrough's work, yet I would not utlize it as a
serious reference or source, anymore than I would the four
Zanthodon books....
BTW, I recommended to the original posting person on this topic
that he read Burroughs and Carter both, primarily so that he
could see what has been done with the idea of a prehistoric
jungle world inside of the Earth, and not necessarily re-hash or
re-create something which has already been done (one well,
one not so well).
--Mike
Mike, I am aware that a great many statesmen, philosophers, authors, poets,
artists and musicians were occultists and secret brotherhood, like Yeats or
Da Vinci, which is how they achieved renown and an elevated status in
history and wove this esoteric knowledge into their concepts or literature.
I have an infuriating habit of arguing both sides of a point in the name of
debate, when in actual fact we are both in agreement on this issue, so let's
stop the argy-bargy. Zanthodon is fantasy,OK? Hazel
literature.
Hazel,
There's little doubt about various secret societies, with more
than "ordinary" knowledge, have been around for some time.
The thing that has always irritated me about this possibility,
however, is the concept that "they" don't consider the rest of "us"
to be worthy of inclusion in their little secrets....Knowledge is
power, always has been, always will be.
As you know, many secret societies allegedly have, at the
highest (or lowest?) levels, a claimed or supposed link to
no-human intelligences or entities which run the whole show.
This has been the rumor for centuries, anyway, and more recent
accounts have simply substituted "aliens" for demons, and so
on.
That Yeats was some mystic, wasn't he? I think that he was
more of a dabbler in the serious mysteries behind things, than
anything else. Even if da Vinci was a member of some society or
other, he was still a genius in his own right! Ditto for Yeats,
Verne, Wells, and the rest!
--Mike
Er, make that NON-human....
--Mike
Dear Mike, >
Yes, but I feel they are invoking unseen entities, the forces of darkness,
fallen angels if you like, Satan's little helpers, rather than some
extraterrestrial race. And by the same token we can summon light beings,
archangels to empower us. It's a conflict between 'gods' in high places. But
maybe it is reptile man...I don't know.
Leonardo Da Vinci, Grand Master of Prieure de Sion was a genius, privy to
arcane secrets, his inventions were primarily geared towards war as he was
military advisor to the Borgias, and invented a proto-type helicopter in the
15th Century. He also invented a 'tank-machine,' in a circular shape with a
dome, like a typical UFO. His church designs were full of sacred geometry.
One of my favourite artists, nonetheless. Hazel.
Hazel, Brian Allan on fantasticreality has extensive knowledge
about this topic. Have you corresponded with him about it at all?
Apparently he knows the authors of some of the best books on
this topic, as they are personal friends of his. You should have
seen one of his recent posts about ongoing cover-ups in the
U.K., along with a few choice tidbits about the so-called House of
Windsor....
--Mike
Well, there's no human intelligence in the White House, that's for sure. But
perhaps the non-human entities are subservient to the Occultists, doing
their bidding? Isn't Bohemian Grove sinister? Hazel
MOTTIMORPH wrote:
Mike, Brian sent me some of his articles and I gave him some info for
Alternative 3, an old forgotton conspiracy he's had the sense to rekindle.
His knowledge is indeed extensive, but he's still a sceptic, strange. Hazel.
Yes it is. I'm sure you've heard the various stories. Clinton,
Kissinger, and the rest all in the same club?
They supposedly sacrifice or perform rituals to an "owl deity"
statue. The "owl deity" is one of the symbols of Lilith and her
offspring the lilitu, underworld demons of a sort.
Have you read David Icke's work on these inter-related topics at
all?
Three years ago I tended to dismiss him. After reading his work
and checking into much of what he has to say--or seeing it come
to pass on the nightly news, right before my eyes--I have to say
that he is DEFINITELY onto something. Now I find that I agree
with about 70 percent of what he says. He backs up his claims
with a good deal of research and facts, as well.
--Mike