Thoughts on hostile aliens

Many of us in this e-mail group seem to have read books on UFOs and wondered what they are really all about. UFOs are an inner- and/or extraterrestial phenomenon and when one delves deeper into the questions: where do they come from, why do they interfere with humankind and what is their ultimate goal, one finally discovers the frightening and unbelieveable truth.

Thousands of people have been abducted, undergone physical �examinations� and been implanted. There is an abhorrent alien/homo sapiens collaboration taking place under Dulce, N.M. and in other underground laboratories. See the Branton files.

Now, when we have recovered from our shock we must ask ourselves, why we, as inhabitants of planet earth, have to experience this scenario in which we are the helpless victims.

We have to try to see what is happening from a different perspective, an elevated point of view: the aliens (greys/reptiloids) are like a mirror reflecting us human beings, only on shifted levels. The places of action are different, but the experiences being made on these scenes of action are same: exploitation, subjugation, undiscribable horror, pain, death.

Aliens kidnap people, use them for genetic experiments, violate their bodies and souls without mercy, compassion or any sign of love. Yet, in a way one could see them as our elder brothers, as they are far more advanced than us, at least technologically.

Also we human beings are elder brothers of another species: our younger brothers are the animals. And how do WE treat our younger brothers ? Thousands, if not millions of animals worldwide die most painfully in pharmaceutical tests/experiments. Definitely here in Europe, but surely also in the US, etc., maybe India is an exception. Animals by the millions are being bred, transported and slaughtered to please our taste buds � without compassion, love or mercy.

Can you see the connection ? This is the law of KARMA in action: �An eye for an eye�, �what you sow you shall reap�, �as underneath so above�. I don�t want to appear like a preacher with his accusing finger pointing at humanity, but I feel that mankind in the last century and at present has/is committing unspeakable crimes against their younger brothers, who also feel: love, hate, horror, jealousy, motherly love, etc. Our guilt is forever growing (see also the latest experiments with cloning) and we all will have to pay for our actions. Whatever will come upon us in the future and this, I can asure you will be anything but pleasant, we have brought it onto ourselves.

Behind the scenes there are laws in action, spiritual laws, which none of us will escape.

I think, that everybody should in a quiet moment ask themself: Where do I stand, on which side am I in this scenario ? Do I let others � the butchers � do their bloody work for me ? Do I also contribute to pain and horror inflicted on the animal kingdom ? (By the way, you can live quite well as a vegetarian as I and my almost grown up children have experienced over the last 23 years). I think we all should re-think our actions and habits with regard to love for other living beings.

As, whatever the future will hold in store for us, we will only experience that from which we, as souls, can learn and grow and develop.

So far my thoughts on the spiritual aspects of hostile aliens (greys/reptiloids).

Maya

···

_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

Maya,
I'm not a big meat eater myself but your rationale is so severely flawed I
have to comment on it. I was raised with this notion of karma as my father
was into eastern philosophy. Now as a free thinking adult, I have a lot of
trouble with the concept. It is purely a faith based belief system like any
other religious dogma and has absolutely no basis that can be proved.
"Good" people suffer and "bad" people prosper sometime. Can you say O.J.?
The whole concept of "justice" and fairness are purely HUMAN concepts and
are ASSIGNED to things. Such concepts do not exist by themselves. Such
concepts do not exist at all in the animal kingdom either. If you are well
educated in natural science you will already know this. The animals, our
"younger brothers", live a cold cruel existence of eat or be eaten, predator
and prey, and survival of the fittest. This is the cold hard fact and runs
totally contrary to your human concept of karma. Going by your philosophy
all predators must be incurring a horrible karmic debt to their prey unless
of course the "law" only applies to we humans which is a convenient escape
route from any logical rationale applied to the subject.
What about our wonderfully intelligent and "spiritual" brothers the dolphins
and whales? Think of the millions of individual souls they devour, the tons
of living fish they eat every day. Is there compassion shown by these
creatures for their dinner? Absolutely not. Are they spiritually or
morally deficient because of this? No. They are carnivores plain and
simple. You know our sweet little puddy tats ( I have two) don't only kill
for food, but like killer whales they torment and torture their prey and may
or may not even eat their kill after these acts. The concept of mercy,
decency, compassion, reciprocity, etc. are all HUMAN attributes only and
have even been recently linked to a part of the human brain, the frontal
lobe. Applying these traits and therefore responsibilities to other
species is absurd. Nature did not give them the equipment to do math and
they don't have the equipment to show compassion either. Much of the
attributes we even give our house pets are really projected assumptions from
an anthropomorphic point of view.
So going by karma, since we as a species have killed and experimented with
animals, we "have it coming" so to speak from the aliens. Well answer me
this..what did our bovine friends who never did anything more than eat grass
do to deserve wholesale slaughter only to wind up in a quarter pounder with
cheese? Must have done something horrific to deserve this!
There is no logical answer to this because there is no logical answer to the
concept of karma because it's just that! A concept!
It is so easily bought into because it appeals directly to our human
instinct for the desire of fairness and justice but fairness and justice are
attributes we developed over time becaue we are social animals with highly
developed brains.

Sean

Many of us in this e-mail group seem to have read books on UFOs and

wondered

what they are really all about. UFOs are an inner- and/or extraterrestial
phenomenon and when one delves deeper into the questions: where do they

come

from, why do they interfere with humankind and what is their ultimate

goal,

one finally discovers the frightening and unbelieveable truth.

Thousands of people have been abducted, undergone physical "examinations"
and been implanted. There is an abhorrent alien/homo sapiens collaboration
taking place under Dulce, N.M. and in other underground laboratories. See
the Branton files.

Now, when we have recovered from our shock we must ask ourselves, why we,

as

inhabitants of planet earth, have to experience this scenario in which we
are the helpless victims.

We have to try to see what is happening from a different perspective, an
elevated point of view: the aliens (greys/reptiloids) are like a mirror
reflecting us human beings, only on shifted levels. The places of action

are

different, but the experiences being made on these scenes of action are
same: exploitation, subjugation, undiscribable horror, pain, death.

Aliens kidnap people, use them for genetic experiments, violate their

bodies

and souls without mercy, compassion or any sign of love. Yet, in a way one
could see them as our elder brothers, as they are far more advanced than

us,

at least technologically.

Also we human beings are elder brothers of another species: our younger
brothers are the animals. And how do WE treat our younger brothers ?
Thousands, if not millions of animals worldwide die most painfully in
pharmaceutical tests/experiments. Definitely here in Europe, but surely

also

in the US, etc., maybe India is an exception. Animals by the millions are
being bred, transported and slaughtered to please our taste buds - without
compassion, love or mercy.

Can you see the connection ? This is the law of KARMA in action: "An eye

for

an eye", "what you sow you shall reap", "as underneath so above". I don't
want to appear like a preacher with his accusing finger pointing at
humanity, but I feel that mankind in the last century and at present

has/is

committing unspeakable crimes against their younger brothers, who also

feel:

love, hate, horror, jealousy, motherly love, etc. Our guilt is forever
growing (see also the latest experiments with cloning) and we all will

have

to pay for our actions. Whatever will come upon us in the future and this,

I

can asure you will be anything but pleasant, we have brought it onto
ourselves.

Behind the scenes there are laws in action, spiritual laws, which none of

us

will escape.

I think, that everybody should in a quiet moment ask themself: Where do I
stand, on which side am I in this scenario ? Do I let others - the

butchers

- do their bloody work for me ? Do I also contribute to pain and horror
inflicted on the animal kingdom ? (By the way, you can live quite well as

a

···

----- Original Message -----
From: "Maya Oz" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:50 AM
Subject: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens

vegetarian as I and my almost grown up children have experienced over the
last 23 years). I think we all should re-think our actions and habits with
regard to love for other living beings.

As, whatever the future will hold in store for us, we will only experience
that from which we, as souls, can learn and grow and develop.

So far my thoughts on the spiritual aspects of hostile aliens
(greys/reptiloids).

Maya

_________________________________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com.

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

Sean,

Here's another thought, linked to what you just stated. What if we are all
being duped into this notion of karma on purpose? The aim being that we
become fatalists and passively accept our fates?

How many people put up with rubbish because they believe they can't fight
karma?

How many people put up with evil government because they feel it's all part
of a divine plan?

Just how untouchable have we allowed evil to become in this world?

And thus how much have we given evil power over us? Just as the divine book
foretold.

And since the good book says we'll mostly all be duped by a false prophet
near the end of times, do we ever question the most popular belief systems
of the new age new world movement? Who is more likely to succeed in duping
us? Someone who sprouts the popular thought of the day.

Maya,

Personally I love animals and have gone vegetarian. But not for the reason
you think. With Mad Cow disease racing around the world and (2 thai people
are now infected) mad sheep etc soon to become the norm (based on news
reports) I think a better argument would be for us to not eat anything whose
diet we cannot supervise...

all the best
Nikki Hill

···

----- Original Message -----
From: Sean Kinkade <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 12:36 AM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens

----- Original Message -----
From: "Maya Oz" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:50 AM
Subject: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens

   Maya,
I'm not a big meat eater myself but your rationale is so severely flawed

I

have to comment on it. I was raised with this notion of karma as my

father

was into eastern philosophy. Now as a free thinking adult, I have a lot

of

trouble with the concept. It is purely a faith based belief system like

any

other religious dogma and has absolutely no basis that can be proved.
"Good" people suffer and "bad" people prosper sometime. Can you say O.J.?
The whole concept of "justice" and fairness are purely HUMAN concepts and
are ASSIGNED to things. Such concepts do not exist by themselves. Such
concepts do not exist at all in the animal kingdom either. If you are

well

educated in natural science you will already know this. The animals, our
"younger brothers", live a cold cruel existence of eat or be eaten,

predator

and prey, and survival of the fittest. This is the cold hard fact and

runs

totally contrary to your human concept of karma. Going by your philosophy
all predators must be incurring a horrible karmic debt to their prey

unless

of course the "law" only applies to we humans which is a convenient escape
route from any logical rationale applied to the subject.
What about our wonderfully intelligent and "spiritual" brothers the

dolphins

and whales? Think of the millions of individual souls they devour, the

tons

of living fish they eat every day. Is there compassion shown by these
creatures for their dinner? Absolutely not. Are they spiritually or
morally deficient because of this? No. They are carnivores plain and
simple. You know our sweet little puddy tats ( I have two) don't only

kill

for food, but like killer whales they torment and torture their prey and

may

or may not even eat their kill after these acts. The concept of mercy,
decency, compassion, reciprocity, etc. are all HUMAN attributes only and
have even been recently linked to a part of the human brain, the frontal
lobe. Applying these traits and therefore responsibilities to other
species is absurd. Nature did not give them the equipment to do math and
they don't have the equipment to show compassion either. Much of the
attributes we even give our house pets are really projected assumptions

from

an anthropomorphic point of view.
So going by karma, since we as a species have killed and experimented

with

animals, we "have it coming" so to speak from the aliens. Well answer me
this..what did our bovine friends who never did anything more than eat

grass

do to deserve wholesale slaughter only to wind up in a quarter pounder

with

cheese? Must have done something horrific to deserve this!
There is no logical answer to this because there is no logical answer to

the

concept of karma because it's just that! A concept!
It is so easily bought into because it appeals directly to our human
instinct for the desire of fairness and justice but fairness and justice

are

attributes we developed over time becaue we are social animals with highly
developed brains.

Sean

> Many of us in this e-mail group seem to have read books on UFOs and
wondered
> what they are really all about. UFOs are an inner- and/or

extraterrestial

> phenomenon and when one delves deeper into the questions: where do they
come
> from, why do they interfere with humankind and what is their ultimate
goal,
> one finally discovers the frightening and unbelieveable truth.
>
> Thousands of people have been abducted, undergone physical

"examinations"

> and been implanted. There is an abhorrent alien/homo sapiens

collaboration

> taking place under Dulce, N.M. and in other underground laboratories.

See

> the Branton files.
>
> Now, when we have recovered from our shock we must ask ourselves, why

we,

as
> inhabitants of planet earth, have to experience this scenario in which

we

> are the helpless victims.
>
> We have to try to see what is happening from a different perspective, an
> elevated point of view: the aliens (greys/reptiloids) are like a mirror
> reflecting us human beings, only on shifted levels. The places of action
are
> different, but the experiences being made on these scenes of action are
> same: exploitation, subjugation, undiscribable horror, pain, death.
>
> Aliens kidnap people, use them for genetic experiments, violate their
bodies
> and souls without mercy, compassion or any sign of love. Yet, in a way

one

> could see them as our elder brothers, as they are far more advanced than
us,
> at least technologically.
>
> Also we human beings are elder brothers of another species: our younger
> brothers are the animals. And how do WE treat our younger brothers ?
> Thousands, if not millions of animals worldwide die most painfully in
> pharmaceutical tests/experiments. Definitely here in Europe, but surely
also
> in the US, etc., maybe India is an exception. Animals by the millions

are

> being bred, transported and slaughtered to please our taste buds -

without

> compassion, love or mercy.
>
> Can you see the connection ? This is the law of KARMA in action: "An eye
for
> an eye", "what you sow you shall reap", "as underneath so above". I

don't

> want to appear like a preacher with his accusing finger pointing at
> humanity, but I feel that mankind in the last century and at present
has/is
> committing unspeakable crimes against their younger brothers, who also
feel:
> love, hate, horror, jealousy, motherly love, etc. Our guilt is forever
> growing (see also the latest experiments with cloning) and we all will
have
> to pay for our actions. Whatever will come upon us in the future and

this,

I
> can asure you will be anything but pleasant, we have brought it onto
> ourselves.
>
> Behind the scenes there are laws in action, spiritual laws, which none

of

us
> will escape.
>
> I think, that everybody should in a quiet moment ask themself: Where do

I

> stand, on which side am I in this scenario ? Do I let others - the
butchers
> - do their bloody work for me ? Do I also contribute to pain and horror
> inflicted on the animal kingdom ? (By the way, you can live quite well

as

a
> vegetarian as I and my almost grown up children have experienced over

the

> last 23 years). I think we all should re-think our actions and habits

with

> regard to love for other living beings.
>
> As, whatever the future will hold in store for us, we will only

experience

> that from which we, as souls, can learn and grow and develop.
>
> So far my thoughts on the spiritual aspects of hostile aliens
> (greys/reptiloids).
>
> Maya
>
>

_________________________________________________________________________

> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

http://www.hotmail.com.

>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
>

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

Nikki,
You have some good points. I have a big problem with the "as Allah wills" or
"it's their karma" mentality. I spent three weeks in Cairo and that is the
BIG COP OUT I heard over and over! That is one reason why so many people
over there in the middle east and India live in squalor in my opinion.

Nature always seems to win in this plane of existence. Any pacifistic or
so called spirtitually enlightened group that is not prepared to defend
itself is destined to perish because that notion is based on a false
reality, at least in this dimension. Case in point? Look at the Dalai Lama
and other monks over in Tibet. Their spiritual enlightenment did nothing to
protect them from the assaults of the hard liner red Chinese. Monks have
been massacred over there. Peaceful, pacifistic, "enlightened" monks.
Shoots holes in the notion of karma doesn't it? At least the Branch
Davidians had a good enough dose of reality to arm themselves.

I don't mean to offend anyone but Christianity itself could be looked upon
as a perfect religion for export to ones enemies. If your own people did
not beleive or abide by the Christian principles and your enemy did you
would have the advantage. The fortunate contradiction here is for our
country's sake ( which at least was for the most part a Christian nation )
is that Christian principles of turning the other cheek has never really
been applied to our government or military. If we practiced what our
nations religion preached we would have been conquered long ago.

I once read something in some UFO book that stirred my interest ( Zacharia
Stitchin I think)and that was that if we were genetically manipulated by
these "others", couldn't we have been given specific desired traits? Just
as we humans have domesticated dogs from wild dogs through selective
breeding and obtained certain desirable traits such as loyalty and
obedience, it was stated that perhaps we humans were genetically bred to
have the tendency "to serve".
Notice in just about all religions a subservience of mind and soul is
encouraged and is said to be "good" and spiritual and required for communion
with God. Any rebellion is deemed "evil" and assigned to satan. Most of us
tend to go along with this way of thinking, it makes sense that we should be
subservient to our creator after all. But we may feel this way because we
can't help it just as a bird dog can't help but want to hunt birds. It may
be in our genetic code and therefore we may have the tendency to be easily
duped.

Sean

Sean,

Here's another thought, linked to what you just stated. What if we are all
being duped into this notion of karma on purpose? The aim being that we
become fatalists and passively accept our fates?

How many people put up with rubbish because they believe they can't fight
karma?

How many people put up with evil government because they feel it's all

part

of a divine plan?

Just how untouchable have we allowed evil to become in this world?

And thus how much have we given evil power over us? Just as the divine

book

foretold.

And since the good book says we'll mostly all be duped by a false prophet
near the end of times, do we ever question the most popular belief systems
of the new age new world movement? Who is more likely to succeed in duping
us? Someone who sprouts the popular thought of the day.

Maya,

Personally I love animals and have gone vegetarian. But not for the reason
you think. With Mad Cow disease racing around the world and (2 thai people
are now infected) mad sheep etc soon to become the norm (based on news
reports) I think a better argument would be for us to not eat anything

whose

diet we cannot supervise...

all the best
Nikki Hill

From: Sean Kinkade <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 12:36 AM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens

>
> From: "Maya Oz" <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:50 AM
> Subject: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens
>
>
> Maya,
> I'm not a big meat eater myself but your rationale is so severely

flawed

I
> have to comment on it. I was raised with this notion of karma as my
father
> was into eastern philosophy. Now as a free thinking adult, I have a lot
of
> trouble with the concept. It is purely a faith based belief system like
any
> other religious dogma and has absolutely no basis that can be proved.
> "Good" people suffer and "bad" people prosper sometime. Can you say

O.J.?

> The whole concept of "justice" and fairness are purely HUMAN concepts

and

> are ASSIGNED to things. Such concepts do not exist by themselves. Such
> concepts do not exist at all in the animal kingdom either. If you are
well
> educated in natural science you will already know this. The animals,

our

> "younger brothers", live a cold cruel existence of eat or be eaten,
predator
> and prey, and survival of the fittest. This is the cold hard fact and
runs
> totally contrary to your human concept of karma. Going by your

philosophy

> all predators must be incurring a horrible karmic debt to their prey
unless
> of course the "law" only applies to we humans which is a convenient

escape

> route from any logical rationale applied to the subject.
> What about our wonderfully intelligent and "spiritual" brothers the
dolphins
> and whales? Think of the millions of individual souls they devour, the
tons
> of living fish they eat every day. Is there compassion shown by these
> creatures for their dinner? Absolutely not. Are they spiritually or
> morally deficient because of this? No. They are carnivores plain and
> simple. You know our sweet little puddy tats ( I have two) don't only
kill
> for food, but like killer whales they torment and torture their prey and
may
> or may not even eat their kill after these acts. The concept of mercy,
> decency, compassion, reciprocity, etc. are all HUMAN attributes only and
> have even been recently linked to a part of the human brain, the frontal
> lobe. Applying these traits and therefore responsibilities to other
> species is absurd. Nature did not give them the equipment to do math

and

> they don't have the equipment to show compassion either. Much of the
> attributes we even give our house pets are really projected assumptions
from
> an anthropomorphic point of view.
> So going by karma, since we as a species have killed and experimented
with
> animals, we "have it coming" so to speak from the aliens. Well answer

me

> this..what did our bovine friends who never did anything more than eat
grass
> do to deserve wholesale slaughter only to wind up in a quarter pounder
with
> cheese? Must have done something horrific to deserve this!
> There is no logical answer to this because there is no logical answer to
the
> concept of karma because it's just that! A concept!
> It is so easily bought into because it appeals directly to our human
> instinct for the desire of fairness and justice but fairness and justice
are
> attributes we developed over time becaue we are social animals with

highly

> developed brains.
>
> Sean
>
>
>
> > Many of us in this e-mail group seem to have read books on UFOs and
> wondered
> > what they are really all about. UFOs are an inner- and/or
extraterrestial
> > phenomenon and when one delves deeper into the questions: where do

they

> come
> > from, why do they interfere with humankind and what is their ultimate
> goal,
> > one finally discovers the frightening and unbelieveable truth.
> >
> > Thousands of people have been abducted, undergone physical
"examinations"
> > and been implanted. There is an abhorrent alien/homo sapiens
collaboration
> > taking place under Dulce, N.M. and in other underground laboratories.
See
> > the Branton files.
> >
> > Now, when we have recovered from our shock we must ask ourselves, why
we,
> as
> > inhabitants of planet earth, have to experience this scenario in which
we
> > are the helpless victims.
> >
> > We have to try to see what is happening from a different perspective,

an

> > elevated point of view: the aliens (greys/reptiloids) are like a

mirror

> > reflecting us human beings, only on shifted levels. The places of

action

> are
> > different, but the experiences being made on these scenes of action

are

> > same: exploitation, subjugation, undiscribable horror, pain, death.
> >
> > Aliens kidnap people, use them for genetic experiments, violate their
> bodies
> > and souls without mercy, compassion or any sign of love. Yet, in a way
one
> > could see them as our elder brothers, as they are far more advanced

than

> us,
> > at least technologically.
> >
> > Also we human beings are elder brothers of another species: our

younger

> > brothers are the animals. And how do WE treat our younger brothers ?
> > Thousands, if not millions of animals worldwide die most painfully in
> > pharmaceutical tests/experiments. Definitely here in Europe, but

surely

> also
> > in the US, etc., maybe India is an exception. Animals by the millions
are
> > being bred, transported and slaughtered to please our taste buds -
without
> > compassion, love or mercy.
> >
> > Can you see the connection ? This is the law of KARMA in action: "An

eye

> for
> > an eye", "what you sow you shall reap", "as underneath so above". I
don't
> > want to appear like a preacher with his accusing finger pointing at
> > humanity, but I feel that mankind in the last century and at present
> has/is
> > committing unspeakable crimes against their younger brothers, who also
> feel:
> > love, hate, horror, jealousy, motherly love, etc. Our guilt is forever
> > growing (see also the latest experiments with cloning) and we all will
> have
> > to pay for our actions. Whatever will come upon us in the future and
this,
> I
> > can asure you will be anything but pleasant, we have brought it onto
> > ourselves.
> >
> > Behind the scenes there are laws in action, spiritual laws, which none
of
> us
> > will escape.
> >
> > I think, that everybody should in a quiet moment ask themself: Where

do

I
> > stand, on which side am I in this scenario ? Do I let others - the
> butchers
> > - do their bloody work for me ? Do I also contribute to pain and

horror

···

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nikki" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 12:38 PM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] What... if?

----- Original Message -----
> ----- Original Message -----
> > inflicted on the animal kingdom ? (By the way, you can live quite well
as
> a
> > vegetarian as I and my almost grown up children have experienced over
the
> > last 23 years). I think we all should re-think our actions and habits
with
> > regard to love for other living beings.
> >
> > As, whatever the future will hold in store for us, we will only
experience
> > that from which we, as souls, can learn and grow and develop.
> >
> > So far my thoughts on the spiritual aspects of hostile aliens
> > (greys/reptiloids).
> >
> > Maya
> >
> >
_________________________________________________________________________
> > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
http://www.hotmail.com.
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > [email protected]
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
>

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

If one sees evil and does nothing that one is a partaker of the evil.

As for mad cow some people in positions of authority have been advocating
reduction of the earth's population to 2 billion. Some, like Maurice Strong,
advocate 500 million. They say this MUST be accomplished no later than 2050.
Even Prince Philip said he wishe to be re-incarnated as an AIDS virus so he
could help clean this cancer, mankind, from the planet. CWD or CJD or mad
cow, whatever you want to call it, has this potential.
Kirk

···

-----Original Message-----
From: Nikki [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:39 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] What... if?

Sean,

Here's another thought, linked to what you just stated. What if we are all
being duped into this notion of karma on purpose? The aim being that we
become fatalists and passively accept our fates?

How many people put up with rubbish because they believe they can't fight
karma?

How many people put up with evil government because they feel it's all part
of a divine plan?

Just how untouchable have we allowed evil to become in this world?

And thus how much have we given evil power over us? Just as the divine book
foretold.

And since the good book says we'll mostly all be duped by a false prophet
near the end of times, do we ever question the most popular belief systems
of the new age new world movement? Who is more likely to succeed in duping
us? Someone who sprouts the popular thought of the day.

Maya,

Personally I love animals and have gone vegetarian. But not for the reason
you think. With Mad Cow disease racing around the world and (2 thai people
are now infected) mad sheep etc soon to become the norm (based on news
reports) I think a better argument would be for us to not eat anything whose
diet we cannot supervise...

all the best
Nikki Hill

----- Original Message -----
From: Sean Kinkade <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 12:36 AM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens

----- Original Message -----
From: "Maya Oz" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:50 AM
Subject: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens

   Maya,
I'm not a big meat eater myself but your rationale is so severely flawed

I

have to comment on it. I was raised with this notion of karma as my

father

was into eastern philosophy. Now as a free thinking adult, I have a lot

of

trouble with the concept. It is purely a faith based belief system like

any

other religious dogma and has absolutely no basis that can be proved.
"Good" people suffer and "bad" people prosper sometime. Can you say O.J.?
The whole concept of "justice" and fairness are purely HUMAN concepts and
are ASSIGNED to things. Such concepts do not exist by themselves. Such
concepts do not exist at all in the animal kingdom either. If you are

well

educated in natural science you will already know this. The animals, our
"younger brothers", live a cold cruel existence of eat or be eaten,

predator

and prey, and survival of the fittest. This is the cold hard fact and

runs

totally contrary to your human concept of karma. Going by your philosophy
all predators must be incurring a horrible karmic debt to their prey

unless

of course the "law" only applies to we humans which is a convenient escape
route from any logical rationale applied to the subject.
What about our wonderfully intelligent and "spiritual" brothers the

dolphins

and whales? Think of the millions of individual souls they devour, the

tons

of living fish they eat every day. Is there compassion shown by these
creatures for their dinner? Absolutely not. Are they spiritually or
morally deficient because of this? No. They are carnivores plain and
simple. You know our sweet little puddy tats ( I have two) don't only

kill

for food, but like killer whales they torment and torture their prey and

may

or may not even eat their kill after these acts. The concept of mercy,
decency, compassion, reciprocity, etc. are all HUMAN attributes only and
have even been recently linked to a part of the human brain, the frontal
lobe. Applying these traits and therefore responsibilities to other
species is absurd. Nature did not give them the equipment to do math and
they don't have the equipment to show compassion either. Much of the
attributes we even give our house pets are really projected assumptions

from

an anthropomorphic point of view.
So going by karma, since we as a species have killed and experimented

with

animals, we "have it coming" so to speak from the aliens. Well answer me
this..what did our bovine friends who never did anything more than eat

grass

do to deserve wholesale slaughter only to wind up in a quarter pounder

with

cheese? Must have done something horrific to deserve this!
There is no logical answer to this because there is no logical answer to

the

concept of karma because it's just that! A concept!
It is so easily bought into because it appeals directly to our human
instinct for the desire of fairness and justice but fairness and justice

are

attributes we developed over time becaue we are social animals with highly
developed brains.

Sean

> Many of us in this e-mail group seem to have read books on UFOs and
wondered
> what they are really all about. UFOs are an inner- and/or

extraterrestial

> phenomenon and when one delves deeper into the questions: where do they
come
> from, why do they interfere with humankind and what is their ultimate
goal,
> one finally discovers the frightening and unbelieveable truth.
>
> Thousands of people have been abducted, undergone physical

"examinations"

> and been implanted. There is an abhorrent alien/homo sapiens

collaboration

> taking place under Dulce, N.M. and in other underground laboratories.

See

> the Branton files.
>
> Now, when we have recovered from our shock we must ask ourselves, why

we,

as
> inhabitants of planet earth, have to experience this scenario in which

we

> are the helpless victims.
>
> We have to try to see what is happening from a different perspective, an
> elevated point of view: the aliens (greys/reptiloids) are like a mirror
> reflecting us human beings, only on shifted levels. The places of action
are
> different, but the experiences being made on these scenes of action are
> same: exploitation, subjugation, undiscribable horror, pain, death.
>
> Aliens kidnap people, use them for genetic experiments, violate their
bodies
> and souls without mercy, compassion or any sign of love. Yet, in a way

one

> could see them as our elder brothers, as they are far more advanced than
us,
> at least technologically.
>
> Also we human beings are elder brothers of another species: our younger
> brothers are the animals. And how do WE treat our younger brothers ?
> Thousands, if not millions of animals worldwide die most painfully in
> pharmaceutical tests/experiments. Definitely here in Europe, but surely
also
> in the US, etc., maybe India is an exception. Animals by the millions

are

> being bred, transported and slaughtered to please our taste buds -

without

> compassion, love or mercy.
>
> Can you see the connection ? This is the law of KARMA in action: "An eye
for
> an eye", "what you sow you shall reap", "as underneath so above". I

don't

> want to appear like a preacher with his accusing finger pointing at
> humanity, but I feel that mankind in the last century and at present
has/is
> committing unspeakable crimes against their younger brothers, who also
feel:
> love, hate, horror, jealousy, motherly love, etc. Our guilt is forever
> growing (see also the latest experiments with cloning) and we all will
have
> to pay for our actions. Whatever will come upon us in the future and

this,

I
> can asure you will be anything but pleasant, we have brought it onto
> ourselves.
>
> Behind the scenes there are laws in action, spiritual laws, which none

of

us
> will escape.
>
> I think, that everybody should in a quiet moment ask themself: Where do

I

> stand, on which side am I in this scenario ? Do I let others - the
butchers
> - do their bloody work for me ? Do I also contribute to pain and horror
> inflicted on the animal kingdom ? (By the way, you can live quite well

as

a
> vegetarian as I and my almost grown up children have experienced over

the

> last 23 years). I think we all should re-think our actions and habits

with

> regard to love for other living beings.
>
> As, whatever the future will hold in store for us, we will only

experience

> that from which we, as souls, can learn and grow and develop.
>
> So far my thoughts on the spiritual aspects of hostile aliens
> (greys/reptiloids).
>
> Maya
>
>

_________________________________________________________________________

> Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at

http://www.hotmail.com.

>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
>

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

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Sean,

Who was it who said "religion is the opiate of the people"?

Seems like even our minds and hearts are drugged - in addition to genetic
fiddling.

I agree with your line of thought. It's about time people woke up. We were
bred to serve, if you listen to the decoders and researchers of the ancient
texts. But if they'd been so sure of us, why the need to add religion and
now the new age movement? I think what is feared most is our intuitive
intelligence, that something is very very wrong in this world.

I'm not an american citizen, but I am shocked by the amount of authoritative
reports of the Bush family's drug peddling and Dick Cheney's global
corporate chairmanship of a company manufacturing arms and peddling oil etc,
plus news that your IRS is a private institution and not entiitled to take
your tax. These are just 2 small examples. In Britain they're producing
videos for schools teaching 4yr old kids how to have homosexual penetrative
sex, for pete's sake. What is going on?

Why aren't people up in arms? Are we - myself included - totally numbed by
the volume of weirdness going on. Or are we all preoccupied with financial
survival? I'm amazed Jan has the stamina to maintain his Hollow earth
investigation, on top of earning a living and dealing with the politics of
SA. I also think it's ironic that we are pre-occupied with fixing what ain't
broke, while ignoring the traitors on top of the surface. I fully
understand our unanimous passion for Hollow Earth on this mailing list. We
are all so battered by the sickness on the surface, we desperately want an
escape hatch.

And as for karma. First we are told we have a say - that we choose before
birth. Then we're told once alive on Earth, that we no longer have a say.
We must bear responsibility for all the murders and crimes that happen
around us because we chose to be here, but we can't change the divine plan.
The individuals that dreamt this lot up were supremely clever strategists.

Oh and they didn't want us all to say hell is on Earth and I'm leaving - we
are told suicide means you have to repeat everything again. Well that's a
flat contradiction isn't it. Once we're out of here, we get to choose
pre-birth whether we want to rejoin the party... according to the same
people who tell us we're responsible in the first place. Since when do they
get to change their tune but we can't?

Surely, until we manage to revolt against the corrupt rulers of this world,
the advanced civilization who welcomed Jansen will never let us in. Since
we're lying down with dogs we're covered in fleas. Why should they?

Nikki

···

----- Original Message -----
From: Sean Kinkade <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 2:04 AM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] What... if?

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nikki" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 12:38 PM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] What... if?

Nikki,
You have some good points. I have a big problem with the "as Allah wills"

or

"it's their karma" mentality. I spent three weeks in Cairo and that is

the

BIG COP OUT I heard over and over! That is one reason why so many people
over there in the middle east and India live in squalor in my opinion.

Nature always seems to win in this plane of existence. Any pacifistic or
so called spirtitually enlightened group that is not prepared to defend
itself is destined to perish because that notion is based on a false
reality, at least in this dimension. Case in point? Look at the Dalai

Lama

and other monks over in Tibet. Their spiritual enlightenment did nothing

to

protect them from the assaults of the hard liner red Chinese. Monks have
been massacred over there. Peaceful, pacifistic, "enlightened" monks.
Shoots holes in the notion of karma doesn't it? At least the Branch
Davidians had a good enough dose of reality to arm themselves.

I don't mean to offend anyone but Christianity itself could be looked upon
as a perfect religion for export to ones enemies. If your own people did
not beleive or abide by the Christian principles and your enemy did you
would have the advantage. The fortunate contradiction here is for our
country's sake ( which at least was for the most part a Christian nation )
is that Christian principles of turning the other cheek has never really
been applied to our government or military. If we practiced what our
nations religion preached we would have been conquered long ago.

I once read something in some UFO book that stirred my interest ( Zacharia
Stitchin I think)and that was that if we were genetically manipulated by
these "others", couldn't we have been given specific desired traits? Just
as we humans have domesticated dogs from wild dogs through selective
breeding and obtained certain desirable traits such as loyalty and
obedience, it was stated that perhaps we humans were genetically bred to
have the tendency "to serve".
Notice in just about all religions a subservience of mind and soul is
encouraged and is said to be "good" and spiritual and required for

communion

with God. Any rebellion is deemed "evil" and assigned to satan. Most of

us

tend to go along with this way of thinking, it makes sense that we should

be

subservient to our creator after all. But we may feel this way because we
can't help it just as a bird dog can't help but want to hunt birds. It

may

be in our genetic code and therefore we may have the tendency to be easily
duped.

Sean

> Sean,
>
> Here's another thought, linked to what you just stated. What if we are

all

> being duped into this notion of karma on purpose? The aim being that we
> become fatalists and passively accept our fates?
>
> How many people put up with rubbish because they believe they can't

fight

> karma?
>
> How many people put up with evil government because they feel it's all
part
> of a divine plan?
>
> Just how untouchable have we allowed evil to become in this world?
>
> And thus how much have we given evil power over us? Just as the divine
book
> foretold.
>
> And since the good book says we'll mostly all be duped by a false

prophet

> near the end of times, do we ever question the most popular belief

systems

> of the new age new world movement? Who is more likely to succeed in

duping

> us? Someone who sprouts the popular thought of the day.
>
> Maya,
>
> Personally I love animals and have gone vegetarian. But not for the

reason

> you think. With Mad Cow disease racing around the world and (2 thai

people

> are now infected) mad sheep etc soon to become the norm (based on news
> reports) I think a better argument would be for us to not eat anything
whose
> diet we cannot supervise...
>
> all the best
> Nikki Hill
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Sean Kinkade <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 12:36 AM
> Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens
>
>
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Maya Oz" <[email protected]>
> > To: <[email protected]>
> > Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:50 AM
> > Subject: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens
> >
> >
> > Maya,
> > I'm not a big meat eater myself but your rationale is so severely
flawed
> I
> > have to comment on it. I was raised with this notion of karma as my
> father
> > was into eastern philosophy. Now as a free thinking adult, I have a

lot

> of
> > trouble with the concept. It is purely a faith based belief system

like

> any
> > other religious dogma and has absolutely no basis that can be proved.
> > "Good" people suffer and "bad" people prosper sometime. Can you say
O.J.?
> > The whole concept of "justice" and fairness are purely HUMAN concepts
and
> > are ASSIGNED to things. Such concepts do not exist by themselves.

Such

> > concepts do not exist at all in the animal kingdom either. If you are
> well
> > educated in natural science you will already know this. The animals,
our
> > "younger brothers", live a cold cruel existence of eat or be eaten,
> predator
> > and prey, and survival of the fittest. This is the cold hard fact and
> runs
> > totally contrary to your human concept of karma. Going by your
philosophy
> > all predators must be incurring a horrible karmic debt to their prey
> unless
> > of course the "law" only applies to we humans which is a convenient
escape
> > route from any logical rationale applied to the subject.
> > What about our wonderfully intelligent and "spiritual" brothers the
> dolphins
> > and whales? Think of the millions of individual souls they devour,

the

> tons
> > of living fish they eat every day. Is there compassion shown by

these

> > creatures for their dinner? Absolutely not. Are they spiritually or
> > morally deficient because of this? No. They are carnivores plain and
> > simple. You know our sweet little puddy tats ( I have two) don't only
> kill
> > for food, but like killer whales they torment and torture their prey

and

> may
> > or may not even eat their kill after these acts. The concept of

mercy,

> > decency, compassion, reciprocity, etc. are all HUMAN attributes only

and

> > have even been recently linked to a part of the human brain, the

frontal

> > lobe. Applying these traits and therefore responsibilities to other
> > species is absurd. Nature did not give them the equipment to do math
and
> > they don't have the equipment to show compassion either. Much of the
> > attributes we even give our house pets are really projected

assumptions

> from
> > an anthropomorphic point of view.
> > So going by karma, since we as a species have killed and experimented
> with
> > animals, we "have it coming" so to speak from the aliens. Well

answer

me
> > this..what did our bovine friends who never did anything more than eat
> grass
> > do to deserve wholesale slaughter only to wind up in a quarter pounder
> with
> > cheese? Must have done something horrific to deserve this!
> > There is no logical answer to this because there is no logical answer

to

> the
> > concept of karma because it's just that! A concept!
> > It is so easily bought into because it appeals directly to our human
> > instinct for the desire of fairness and justice but fairness and

justice

> are
> > attributes we developed over time becaue we are social animals with
highly
> > developed brains.
> >
> > Sean
> >
> >
> >
> > > Many of us in this e-mail group seem to have read books on UFOs and
> > wondered
> > > what they are really all about. UFOs are an inner- and/or
> extraterrestial
> > > phenomenon and when one delves deeper into the questions: where do
they
> > come
> > > from, why do they interfere with humankind and what is their

ultimate

> > goal,
> > > one finally discovers the frightening and unbelieveable truth.
> > >
> > > Thousands of people have been abducted, undergone physical
> "examinations"
> > > and been implanted. There is an abhorrent alien/homo sapiens
> collaboration
> > > taking place under Dulce, N.M. and in other underground

laboratories.

> See
> > > the Branton files.
> > >
> > > Now, when we have recovered from our shock we must ask ourselves,

why

> we,
> > as
> > > inhabitants of planet earth, have to experience this scenario in

which

> we
> > > are the helpless victims.
> > >
> > > We have to try to see what is happening from a different

perspective,

an
> > > elevated point of view: the aliens (greys/reptiloids) are like a
mirror
> > > reflecting us human beings, only on shifted levels. The places of
action
> > are
> > > different, but the experiences being made on these scenes of action
are
> > > same: exploitation, subjugation, undiscribable horror, pain, death.
> > >
> > > Aliens kidnap people, use them for genetic experiments, violate

their

> > bodies
> > > and souls without mercy, compassion or any sign of love. Yet, in a

way

> one
> > > could see them as our elder brothers, as they are far more advanced
than
> > us,
> > > at least technologically.
> > >
> > > Also we human beings are elder brothers of another species: our
younger
> > > brothers are the animals. And how do WE treat our younger brothers ?
> > > Thousands, if not millions of animals worldwide die most painfully

in

> > > pharmaceutical tests/experiments. Definitely here in Europe, but
surely
> > also
> > > in the US, etc., maybe India is an exception. Animals by the

millions

> are
> > > being bred, transported and slaughtered to please our taste buds -
> without
> > > compassion, love or mercy.
> > >
> > > Can you see the connection ? This is the law of KARMA in action: "An
eye
> > for
> > > an eye", "what you sow you shall reap", "as underneath so above". I
> don't
> > > want to appear like a preacher with his accusing finger pointing at
> > > humanity, but I feel that mankind in the last century and at present
> > has/is
> > > committing unspeakable crimes against their younger brothers, who

also

> > feel:
> > > love, hate, horror, jealousy, motherly love, etc. Our guilt is

forever

> > > growing (see also the latest experiments with cloning) and we all

will

> > have
> > > to pay for our actions. Whatever will come upon us in the future and
> this,
> > I
> > > can asure you will be anything but pleasant, we have brought it onto
> > > ourselves.
> > >
> > > Behind the scenes there are laws in action, spiritual laws, which

none

> of
> > us
> > > will escape.
> > >
> > > I think, that everybody should in a quiet moment ask themself: Where
do
> I
> > > stand, on which side am I in this scenario ? Do I let others - the
> > butchers
> > > - do their bloody work for me ? Do I also contribute to pain and
horror
> > > inflicted on the animal kingdom ? (By the way, you can live quite

well

> as
> > a
> > > vegetarian as I and my almost grown up children have experienced

over

> the
> > > last 23 years). I think we all should re-think our actions and

habits

> with
> > > regard to love for other living beings.
> > >
> > > As, whatever the future will hold in store for us, we will only
> experience
> > > that from which we, as souls, can learn and grow and develop.
> > >
> > > So far my thoughts on the spiritual aspects of hostile aliens
> > > (greys/reptiloids).
> > >
> > > Maya
> > >
> > >
>

_________________________________________________________________________

> > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
> http://www.hotmail.com.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > [email protected]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > [email protected]
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
>

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

Well said Nikki!

Sean,

Who was it who said "religion is the opiate of the people"?

Seems like even our minds and hearts are drugged - in addition to genetic
fiddling.

I agree with your line of thought. It's about time people woke up. We were
bred to serve, if you listen to the decoders and researchers of the

ancient

texts. But if they'd been so sure of us, why the need to add religion and
now the new age movement? I think what is feared most is our intuitive
intelligence, that something is very very wrong in this world.

I'm not an american citizen, but I am shocked by the amount of

authoritative

reports of the Bush family's drug peddling and Dick Cheney's global
corporate chairmanship of a company manufacturing arms and peddling oil

etc,

plus news that your IRS is a private institution and not entiitled to take
your tax. These are just 2 small examples. In Britain they're producing
videos for schools teaching 4yr old kids how to have homosexual

penetrative

sex, for pete's sake. What is going on?

Why aren't people up in arms? Are we - myself included - totally numbed by
the volume of weirdness going on. Or are we all preoccupied with financial
survival? I'm amazed Jan has the stamina to maintain his Hollow earth
investigation, on top of earning a living and dealing with the politics of
SA. I also think it's ironic that we are pre-occupied with fixing what

ain't

broke, while ignoring the traitors on top of the surface. I fully
understand our unanimous passion for Hollow Earth on this mailing list.

We

are all so battered by the sickness on the surface, we desperately want an
escape hatch.

And as for karma. First we are told we have a say - that we choose before
birth. Then we're told once alive on Earth, that we no longer have a say.
We must bear responsibility for all the murders and crimes that happen
around us because we chose to be here, but we can't change the divine

plan.

The individuals that dreamt this lot up were supremely clever strategists.

Oh and they didn't want us all to say hell is on Earth and I'm leaving -

we

are told suicide means you have to repeat everything again. Well that's a
flat contradiction isn't it. Once we're out of here, we get to choose
pre-birth whether we want to rejoin the party... according to the same
people who tell us we're responsible in the first place. Since when do

they

get to change their tune but we can't?

Surely, until we manage to revolt against the corrupt rulers of this

world,

the advanced civilization who welcomed Jansen will never let us in. Since
we're lying down with dogs we're covered in fleas. Why should they?

Nikki

From: Sean Kinkade <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 2:04 AM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] What... if?

>
> From: "Nikki" <[email protected]>
> To: <[email protected]>
> Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 12:38 PM
> Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] What... if?
>
> Nikki,
> You have some good points. I have a big problem with the "as Allah

wills"

or
> "it's their karma" mentality. I spent three weeks in Cairo and that is
the
> BIG COP OUT I heard over and over! That is one reason why so many

people

> over there in the middle east and India live in squalor in my opinion.
>
> Nature always seems to win in this plane of existence. Any pacifistic

or

> so called spirtitually enlightened group that is not prepared to defend
> itself is destined to perish because that notion is based on a false
> reality, at least in this dimension. Case in point? Look at the Dalai
Lama
> and other monks over in Tibet. Their spiritual enlightenment did

nothing

to
> protect them from the assaults of the hard liner red Chinese. Monks

have

> been massacred over there. Peaceful, pacifistic, "enlightened" monks.
> Shoots holes in the notion of karma doesn't it? At least the Branch
> Davidians had a good enough dose of reality to arm themselves.
>
> I don't mean to offend anyone but Christianity itself could be looked

upon

> as a perfect religion for export to ones enemies. If your own people

did

> not beleive or abide by the Christian principles and your enemy did you
> would have the advantage. The fortunate contradiction here is for our
> country's sake ( which at least was for the most part a Christian

nation )

> is that Christian principles of turning the other cheek has never really
> been applied to our government or military. If we practiced what our
> nations religion preached we would have been conquered long ago.
>
> I once read something in some UFO book that stirred my interest (

Zacharia

> Stitchin I think)and that was that if we were genetically manipulated by
> these "others", couldn't we have been given specific desired traits?

Just

> as we humans have domesticated dogs from wild dogs through selective
> breeding and obtained certain desirable traits such as loyalty and
> obedience, it was stated that perhaps we humans were genetically bred to
> have the tendency "to serve".
> Notice in just about all religions a subservience of mind and soul is
> encouraged and is said to be "good" and spiritual and required for
communion
> with God. Any rebellion is deemed "evil" and assigned to satan. Most

of

us
> tend to go along with this way of thinking, it makes sense that we

should

be
> subservient to our creator after all. But we may feel this way because

we

> can't help it just as a bird dog can't help but want to hunt birds. It
may
> be in our genetic code and therefore we may have the tendency to be

easily

> duped.
>
> Sean
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > Sean,
> >
> > Here's another thought, linked to what you just stated. What if we are
all
> > being duped into this notion of karma on purpose? The aim being that

we

> > become fatalists and passively accept our fates?
> >
> > How many people put up with rubbish because they believe they can't
fight
> > karma?
> >
> > How many people put up with evil government because they feel it's all
> part
> > of a divine plan?
> >
> > Just how untouchable have we allowed evil to become in this world?
> >
> > And thus how much have we given evil power over us? Just as the divine
> book
> > foretold.
> >
> > And since the good book says we'll mostly all be duped by a false
prophet
> > near the end of times, do we ever question the most popular belief
systems
> > of the new age new world movement? Who is more likely to succeed in
duping
> > us? Someone who sprouts the popular thought of the day.
> >
> > Maya,
> >
> > Personally I love animals and have gone vegetarian. But not for the
reason
> > you think. With Mad Cow disease racing around the world and (2 thai
people
> > are now infected) mad sheep etc soon to become the norm (based on news
> > reports) I think a better argument would be for us to not eat anything
> whose
> > diet we cannot supervise...
> >
> > all the best
> > Nikki Hill
> >
> >
> >
> > From: Sean Kinkade <[email protected]>
> > To: <[email protected]>
> > Sent: Tuesday, February 20, 2001 12:36 AM
> > Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens
> >
> >
> > >
> > > From: "Maya Oz" <[email protected]>
> > > To: <[email protected]>
> > > Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 10:50 AM
> > > Subject: [allplanets-hollow] Thoughts on hostile aliens
> > >
> > >
> > > Maya,
> > > I'm not a big meat eater myself but your rationale is so severely
> flawed
> > I
> > > have to comment on it. I was raised with this notion of karma as my
> > father
> > > was into eastern philosophy. Now as a free thinking adult, I have a
lot
> > of
> > > trouble with the concept. It is purely a faith based belief system
like
> > any
> > > other religious dogma and has absolutely no basis that can be

proved.

> > > "Good" people suffer and "bad" people prosper sometime. Can you say
> O.J.?
> > > The whole concept of "justice" and fairness are purely HUMAN

concepts

> and
> > > are ASSIGNED to things. Such concepts do not exist by themselves.
Such
> > > concepts do not exist at all in the animal kingdom either. If you

are

> > well
> > > educated in natural science you will already know this. The

animals,

> our
> > > "younger brothers", live a cold cruel existence of eat or be eaten,
> > predator
> > > and prey, and survival of the fittest. This is the cold hard fact

and

> > runs
> > > totally contrary to your human concept of karma. Going by your
> philosophy
> > > all predators must be incurring a horrible karmic debt to their prey
> > unless
> > > of course the "law" only applies to we humans which is a convenient
> escape
> > > route from any logical rationale applied to the subject.
> > > What about our wonderfully intelligent and "spiritual" brothers the
> > dolphins
> > > and whales? Think of the millions of individual souls they devour,
the
> > tons
> > > of living fish they eat every day. Is there compassion shown by
these
> > > creatures for their dinner? Absolutely not. Are they spiritually

or

> > > morally deficient because of this? No. They are carnivores plain

and

> > > simple. You know our sweet little puddy tats ( I have two) don't

only

> > kill
> > > for food, but like killer whales they torment and torture their prey
and
> > may
> > > or may not even eat their kill after these acts. The concept of
mercy,
> > > decency, compassion, reciprocity, etc. are all HUMAN attributes only
and
> > > have even been recently linked to a part of the human brain, the
frontal
> > > lobe. Applying these traits and therefore responsibilities to

other

> > > species is absurd. Nature did not give them the equipment to do

math

> and
> > > they don't have the equipment to show compassion either. Much of

the

> > > attributes we even give our house pets are really projected
assumptions
> > from
> > > an anthropomorphic point of view.
> > > So going by karma, since we as a species have killed and

experimented

> > with
> > > animals, we "have it coming" so to speak from the aliens. Well
answer
> me
> > > this..what did our bovine friends who never did anything more than

eat

> > grass
> > > do to deserve wholesale slaughter only to wind up in a quarter

pounder

> > with
> > > cheese? Must have done something horrific to deserve this!
> > > There is no logical answer to this because there is no logical

answer

to
> > the
> > > concept of karma because it's just that! A concept!
> > > It is so easily bought into because it appeals directly to our human
> > > instinct for the desire of fairness and justice but fairness and
justice
> > are
> > > attributes we developed over time becaue we are social animals with
> highly
> > > developed brains.
> > >
> > > Sean
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > Many of us in this e-mail group seem to have read books on UFOs

and

> > > wondered
> > > > what they are really all about. UFOs are an inner- and/or
> > extraterrestial
> > > > phenomenon and when one delves deeper into the questions: where do
> they
> > > come
> > > > from, why do they interfere with humankind and what is their
ultimate
> > > goal,
> > > > one finally discovers the frightening and unbelieveable truth.
> > > >
> > > > Thousands of people have been abducted, undergone physical
> > "examinations"
> > > > and been implanted. There is an abhorrent alien/homo sapiens
> > collaboration
> > > > taking place under Dulce, N.M. and in other underground
laboratories.
> > See
> > > > the Branton files.
> > > >
> > > > Now, when we have recovered from our shock we must ask ourselves,
why
> > we,
> > > as
> > > > inhabitants of planet earth, have to experience this scenario in
which
> > we
> > > > are the helpless victims.
> > > >
> > > > We have to try to see what is happening from a different
perspective,
> an
> > > > elevated point of view: the aliens (greys/reptiloids) are like a
> mirror
> > > > reflecting us human beings, only on shifted levels. The places of
> action
> > > are
> > > > different, but the experiences being made on these scenes of

action

> are
> > > > same: exploitation, subjugation, undiscribable horror, pain,

death.

> > > >
> > > > Aliens kidnap people, use them for genetic experiments, violate
their
> > > bodies
> > > > and souls without mercy, compassion or any sign of love. Yet, in a
way
> > one
> > > > could see them as our elder brothers, as they are far more

advanced

> than
> > > us,
> > > > at least technologically.
> > > >
> > > > Also we human beings are elder brothers of another species: our
> younger
> > > > brothers are the animals. And how do WE treat our younger brothers

?

> > > > Thousands, if not millions of animals worldwide die most painfully
in
> > > > pharmaceutical tests/experiments. Definitely here in Europe, but
> surely
> > > also
> > > > in the US, etc., maybe India is an exception. Animals by the
millions
> > are
> > > > being bred, transported and slaughtered to please our taste buds -
> > without
> > > > compassion, love or mercy.
> > > >
> > > > Can you see the connection ? This is the law of KARMA in action:

"An

> eye
> > > for
> > > > an eye", "what you sow you shall reap", "as underneath so above".

I

> > don't
> > > > want to appear like a preacher with his accusing finger pointing

at

> > > > humanity, but I feel that mankind in the last century and at

present

> > > has/is
> > > > committing unspeakable crimes against their younger brothers, who
also
> > > feel:
> > > > love, hate, horror, jealousy, motherly love, etc. Our guilt is
forever
> > > > growing (see also the latest experiments with cloning) and we all
will
> > > have
> > > > to pay for our actions. Whatever will come upon us in the future

and

> > this,
> > > I
> > > > can asure you will be anything but pleasant, we have brought it

onto

> > > > ourselves.
> > > >
> > > > Behind the scenes there are laws in action, spiritual laws, which
none
> > of
> > > us
> > > > will escape.
> > > >
> > > > I think, that everybody should in a quiet moment ask themself:

Where

> do
> > I
> > > > stand, on which side am I in this scenario ? Do I let others -

the

···

----- Original Message -----
From: "Nikki" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, February 19, 2001 1:48 PM
Subject: Re: [allplanets-hollow] What... if?

----- Original Message -----
> ----- Original Message -----
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > butchers
> > > > - do their bloody work for me ? Do I also contribute to pain and
> horror
> > > > inflicted on the animal kingdom ? (By the way, you can live quite
well
> > as
> > > a
> > > > vegetarian as I and my almost grown up children have experienced
over
> > the
> > > > last 23 years). I think we all should re-think our actions and
habits
> > with
> > > > regard to love for other living beings.
> > > >
> > > > As, whatever the future will hold in store for us, we will only
> > experience
> > > > that from which we, as souls, can learn and grow and develop.
> > > >
> > > > So far my thoughts on the spiritual aspects of hostile aliens
> > > > (greys/reptiloids).
> > > >
> > > > Maya
> > > >
> > > >
> >
_________________________________________________________________________
> > > > Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at
> > http://www.hotmail.com.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > > [email protected]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > > [email protected]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > [email protected]
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> [email protected]
>
>
>
>

To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]

Maya,

For me the ufo phenomena is certainly karmic. We have been and still are the
architechts of our present environment.

I think that, even though this is a hollow earth list, it is good to get
some exposure to the UFO phenom, especially as it relates to the HET. For
example, evidence relating to UFOs entering the openings or seen heading due
North- the " Straight-Line " theory, or anything about UFOs going
underground. My abductions article, second one down called " Underground
Abductions: Whereto? " is about this very angle of the HET:
http://www.skyboom.com/hollowearthpuranas/index12.html

Dharma/Dean

Sean/Maya,

I have just mentioned in a post to Maya that I think that the UFO phenomena
is valid for us, mostly as it relates or is suggestive of the HET.

But discussions on karma are really off topic for us, and such discussions
will just end up dividing us.

Not that I don't like such discussions- I'm on a Vedic list, a tantra list
and a Hindu astrology list, but I never bring up these issues, just some
Puranic legend as it related to the Hollow Earth Theory, and only once in a
while.

hang in there with us,

Dharma/Dean