I'd have to agree with Dean on this. Although I agree with your points, Norlan, I think you were too harsh in your expressing them. Those who make up this list are great people with some interesting theories and ideas to listen to, and as a fellow member of the LDS church, I didn't find anything anyone has said offensive. Defend your beliefs, but don't scare people away.
And Dean, you keep leaving out the most important words of the title of our church! The Church of JESUS CHRIST of Latter-day Saints. Not the Church of Latter-day Saints, which, to me, is a meaningless title.
Blake
ยทยทยท
-----Original Message-----
From: Dean De Lucia [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2001 5:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject:
[allplanets-hollow] Norlan!
Norlan,
I think that you could have made all those points without blowing your lid like that. If somebody wants to question whether a major religious organization might not have " agendas ", or might not be manipulated by aliens or an underground world, then they have the right to do so as long as they mind their manners about it.
Look at the Catholic Church, from the Crusades to WWII- ulterior motives and some incorrect activities. How about Islam- for an illiterate to suddenly go into a trance and dictate a whole scripture, no less, then run off and systematically destroy every last vestige of the previous culture like that is unusual, to say the least. In many circles it has been suggested that Mohamed might have been channeled by the same UFO occupants who are currently interfering with agendas on the surface of the Earth. Even so, the followers of that religion aren't aliens, either.
It is all right to question. However, any questioning, and statement, simply has to stand or fall based on its own merit. You are free to introduce opposing logic- persuasion and logic would have taken you far because, to begin with, the Church of the Latter Day Saints isn't the Catholic Church. For example, your points about the Temple being subject to inspection and such are good points. The place isn't immune like the Vatican.
You were very extreme, you accused some people of over reacting, but you really, really over-reacted. You accused Mike of " aggressive support " of the points he brought up, but he wasn't agressive. You mentioned that he holds those opinions " so dear," but he is not so attached that he has never been willing to hear people out. And you called people ignorant and suggested that people were " stupid " and " idiots."
Your whole tone was the worst thing. Something like this can ruin a list. people might get off because of this or not speak up in the future.
We have to be able to be introspective and hear what others say about us without going ballistic. I've often wondered if the Hare Krishna movement wasn't infiltrated and run into the ground. 95% of the members were very sincere but some heavies elbowed their way to the top and typically made bad decisions and did bad things that couldn't have been scripted better by the movement's worst enemy.
To tell you the truth, I kind of side with you. Niether polygamy, nor the Temple basement, nor church rituals make a case at all.
But you went way beyond the issues, you practically made public fools out of other list members.
I need an hour or two to digest this. There are a lot of new people on the list- I don't want you all to think that the list has been contentious in the past. It has never been. We've spent months just talking about Arctic explorers, digging up maps, talkng about Etidorhpa and stuff like that. it's been a joy, this is an aberration.
Like I say, I need an hour or so.
Dharma/Dean
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